tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post3464930542185966041..comments2024-02-18T08:45:16.295-08:00Comments on The Film Connoisseur: Martyrs (2008)Franco Macabrohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comBlogger23125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-5321466237882740842015-07-06T09:10:13.176-07:002015-07-06T09:10:13.176-07:00Frank Baxter: This film is special to me because f...Frank Baxter: This film is special to me because few films out there dare to speak this way about religion. The symbolism with the scars...the torture...the blindness...but the one that got to me the most was the scars. In the film they are literal, but in real life they are probably more psychological. Awesome movie, truly mind blowing stuff. The most chilling scene for me is the one in which the old lady who is the leader of the cult explains how easy it is to manipulate someone through fear and lies. Thanks for commenting and sharing your thoughts! Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-13400737489712797592015-07-06T06:22:13.892-07:002015-07-06T06:22:13.892-07:00Thank god ( the irony) someone besides me got the ...Thank god ( the irony) someone besides me got the hidden measage of this film . No matter who I showed the movie to , they all completely missed the references and similarities to religion . The cult like any other religion was ready to go to any lengths on the off chance that the myth they believe in might be true . They were ready to torture people , skin them and basically do anything on a hunch with no concrete proof. That is what religion is and that is what religion does ( I dumped the idea of a god the day I learned how to do algebra ) . There were subtle hints as well but for me what stood out for me was the violence and the turmoil refrenced that religion has brought into this world . The best thing was when you show this movie to a normal person they are left completly horrified and utterly disgusted by it but what they dont realise is this is exactly what their religion is , a cloak which evelopes eveything it touches into complete darkness with no ray of hope . This film is one of the finest pieces of art I have ever seen . Frank baxternoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-42935392703467157842013-10-03T11:38:00.395-07:002013-10-03T11:38:00.395-07:00That's a great scene anonymous, I guess it mea...That's a great scene anonymous, I guess it means that religious leaders live under a facade, a mask of lies...most of the time religious leaders clothe themselves in the best attire, expensive clothing, expensive cars, I mean, just look at the pope! He wears gold! This of course in deep contrast with the humility that Jesus displays in the bible. <br /><br />And on a symbolic way, they also wear a facade, they like to project themselves as holier than anyone, the most pure beings, when in reality we know that nobody is holier or more perfect than anybody. When the right buttons are pushed, or the right situations are given, no matter what masks we like to wear, we are all animals, we can all succomb to madness, violence, hatred, it's part of what makes us human, it's in our nature. <br /><br />But when these masks are taken off, we are left with a person as ordinary and as imperfect as the rest of us.<br />Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-1854255125956746572013-10-01T16:23:32.875-07:002013-10-01T16:23:32.875-07:00I believe that all religions leave terrible scars....I believe that all religions leave terrible scars.<br /><br />Here's the thing that no-one has discussed. Madamoiselle has beautifully applied make-up in her appearances. Until her last scene, where alone in the toilet/bathroom she removes her wig/fringe, her head-scarf, her eyelashes and all of the accoutrémonts of beauty and social appearance. As the messenger of Anna's last words all she shares is, "Keep doubting", before blowing her brains out.<br /><br />The message, after all that has gone before? It means nothing......Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-32444939099677203282013-01-28T08:08:02.226-08:002013-01-28T08:08:02.226-08:00I give props to the director for making a movie wi...I give props to the director for making a movie with the guts to say things that many don't dare adress or talk about. <br /><br />This film is not about child abuse, it's about a group of people who wan't to control others, because of their own beliefs. <br /><br />I think if one sees the symbolisms in the film, one can detect that it does enlighten about how belief systems can enslave your mind.<br /><br />If it's a violent and gory film it's because its trying to portray how savagely belief systems can affect a person, certainly not every religion does this, but many do affect people's lives in savagely negative ways, leaving terrible psychological and physical scars. Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-67034172849601375642013-01-26T11:22:11.628-08:002013-01-26T11:22:11.628-08:00You give props to the director for stating the obv...You give props to the director for stating the obvious? brilliant.<br />Certainly this film is for nobody's education, illumination, or edification. Or is it? Who is actually getting off on la petite femme being punched repeatedly in the face? In what way does this film illumine or help to resolve child abuse? It doesn't. because it's a sick-fuck film.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-2787263384904206212011-09-28T11:53:28.065-07:002011-09-28T11:53:28.065-07:00Glad you enjoyed it Elwood, the french are lightye...Glad you enjoyed it Elwood, the french are lightyears ahead in the horror genre, but that could also have to do with the fact that they dont have the MPAA to worry about. <br /><br />I mean, did you ever see INSIDE? Holy Moly what an awesome horror film, such suspense!Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-47814859890228534372011-09-28T11:15:58.716-07:002011-09-28T11:15:58.716-07:00A great (if not easy to sit through) movie and I l...A great (if not easy to sit through) movie and I love your examination or the religious themes of the film, as never having been a religious person I entered into this film not knowing anything about the theories of "Martyrs", so it was great for you to give me that insight with your review.<br />Still I love the debate that this film has sparked since it's release, while being further proof how ahead in the game the French are when it comes to horror, as proven by the likes of "Switchblade Romance" and "Frontier(s)".<br /><br />Good review!Elwood Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09661750406352159996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-51896805450953002382010-06-22T05:08:54.811-07:002010-06-22T05:08:54.811-07:00Thanks Coby, I will keep writing interesting revie...Thanks Coby, I will keep writing interesting reviews if you keep reading them! <br /><br />Cortez, a dude who runs a blog by the name of Planet of Terror (you can find a link to Planet of Terror on the right hand side of my page) also posted a review about this movie, and in it, I think he also saw the religious themes.<br /><br />Glad you are enjoying the reviews Coby!Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-67507314292736623522010-06-21T15:37:10.134-07:002010-06-21T15:37:10.134-07:00You know I've read SOOO many reviews about thi...You know I've read SOOO many reviews about this film and been to SOO many websites like yours and you're the FIRST person to explain it like this in terms of religion! Ur a legend!!<br /><br />I welcome more interesting reviews!Coby147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-39042177398788953902010-06-20T10:38:48.296-07:002010-06-20T10:38:48.296-07:00I saw the spoon feeding and many other symbolisms ...I saw the spoon feeding and many other symbolisms in the film as commenting on religion, because its quite obvious that this is what the film is about, I mean, everything in the film has some sort of religious allegory to it. For example the search for what comes after death, the group gathering, giving false hope to their victims, the psychological scars...<br /><br />Speaking of the films ending, I think the directors left it deliberately ambiguous precisely because the answers to everything are not set in stone, nobody really knows anything, so we are left without a clear answer to anything, which is the way life really is. But ultimately, the filmmakers want the viewer to come up with their own take on things. <br /><br />The torture helped people see the afterlife because they were between life and death. The group tortured their victims almost to the point where they died, so they could get a glimpse of it. As far as the symbolism for this on real life, sometimes religions will make you believe their stories to the point where you start seeing things. This is something that is referenced in the film on various occasions, for example, the girl who escapes and starts seeing visions of other tortured victims, they haunted her. The mention this thing about "people starting to see things" angle on various times during the movie. <br /><br />I guess its just a way of showing how when you are in a religion like for example christianity, they teach you that ghosts are real, that there are angles and demons invisibly watching you from beyond...its not very long before you start hearing supernatural voices or seeing things that are not there. <br /><br />Glad you enjoyed the review Coby!Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-23059070940095736272010-06-20T01:58:25.839-07:002010-06-20T01:58:25.839-07:00Thanks for a whole new perspective! I was religiou...Thanks for a whole new perspective! I was religious, questioned everything, went through an atheist patch then found my way back.. all through logic and reason. Believing ANYTHING without question or thought it OBVIOUSLY dangerous!!<br /><br />Although I look at most things from both an atheist and religious perspective I never thought about the symbolism maybe because I have come to not think about religion as spoon feeding lies and the shackles of rules even though many (maybe even most of the time) this is just how it is.<br /><br />All I kept thinking about after the film is the possible interpretations of the ending, what Anna could have said to MM to make her kill herself and why? She could have intentionally wanted MM to kill herself for the ultimate vengeance or just told the truth. She could have told her she saw a perfect afterlife or nothing at all, the latter of which made MM's life pointless hence suicide.. Keep doubting?<br /><br />Plus why would torture help someone to see the next world? Also why such an interesting philosophy was dealt with as almost an after thought whereas the killing/torture continued for 80 odd minutes. <br /><br />HOWEVER now looking at it as a metaphor for religion it makes a lot more sense! Any thoughts on the superficial meanings I've mentioned would be good.. but again thanks for the deeper meaning!Coby147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-36303576048356375942010-05-31T16:15:09.359-07:002010-05-31T16:15:09.359-07:00@Reina: I told you it was about religion! I picked...@Reina: I told you it was about religion! I picked up on those religious references pretty quickly! Glad you gave this horror movie a chance, see, I keep telling you, every now and then, a good one comes along, you just have to be patient! <br /><br />@Carl:let me know how your second viewing went!Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-53040950367979503962010-05-30T09:42:28.803-07:002010-05-30T09:42:28.803-07:00I will be keeping each of those things in mind in ...I will be keeping each of those things in mind in my second viewing homeslice, thanks for the continued elaboration! Really hope it gives the film whatever it was lacking in the first viewing for me =DI Like Horror Movieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15851268002582984544noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-83226673951905768362010-05-28T09:46:30.135-07:002010-05-28T09:46:30.135-07:00excellent review of an excellent movie..i didn'...excellent review of an excellent movie..i didn't see the religious symbolisms at the beginning of the film, but as the story got more complex, i started to understand what they were trying to say..wow, what a shocking movie...very good job babyReinahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16746319978630932012noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-3944590043973790292010-05-26T18:17:06.291-07:002010-05-26T18:17:06.291-07:00The thing is that the movie talks about all these ...The thing is that the movie talks about all these themes we've discussed about religion, but it does it very subtly. <br /><br />For example, Alice, the girl who escapes, she is haunted by her inner demons, by the memories of her suffering during her days in the dungeons, that suffering was always with her no matter where she went. Those visions she had, of these creatures following her around, its her past haunting her. To me that represented how you can leave a religion, but sometimes its hard for that religion to leave you. They teach you that demons are hovering about, that you might get possessed by SAtan and other such bullcrap, that fear can haunt you forever. That fear of demons and ghosts, just like Alice in Martyrs. The speak about it in the movie "after a while you start seeing things" which is very true in religion. <br /><br />The groups obsession over the afterlife, the way the group chains you, spoon feeds you shit, controls your every action by constraining you to a chair...and then, when you think you have the solution to everything, and you think you are going to know...bang! You are left with a mystery, which is really the way life is. <br /><br />The family in the beginning of the film, a seemingly normal family having a rather cheerful breakfast, but the things they did in their past were so awful that it always comes back to haunt them, same way religions have a dark past. Stuff like the inquisition, the crusades, human sacrifices, torture...in reality, many of the torture devices seen in the movie weren't that different from the torture devices used by the catholic church during the inquisition. <br /><br />The old lady who is the leader of the cult, always an old person in charge of the whole thing. To them it was an experiment they were performing on their subjects.<br /><br />The words the old lady tells Anna before they lock her up are very important. She tells her how people suffer, and then they need hope, which is what they give Anna after they beat her to a pulp. A lady comes in and tells her "everything is going to be okay" when in reality, everything is going to get worse. <br /><br />Religion functions that way, they convince you that some higher power is going to protect and help you when in reality only you can make things better. <br /><br />Look at the world today, many think the world is going down the toilet so they turn to the church and religion to give them hope that its all going to get better. When in reality, it just might be the other way around. <br /><br />But giving you that illusion, that false hope that some invisible power is right there along side you watching over you and helping you out might help you pass the day better, keep you docile while the powers that be ravage the world. <br /><br />Thanks for the reply Carl! Glad you enjoyed the post!Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-7926333139881379352010-05-26T15:47:33.384-07:002010-05-26T15:47:33.384-07:00Reviews like this make me want to pop the movie ba...Reviews like this make me want to pop the movie back in immediately, because I walked away completely unphazed with absolutely no moral or religious questioning resulting from the mass confusion on screen. Truth be told I was more interested in your background prefacing the review, but youve convinced me to give it an honest second shot! I agree that it is a powerful film that is shot and made professionally, I just found absolutely no enjoyment in it whatsoeverI Like Horror Movieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15851268002582984544noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-82985476459604219492010-05-26T05:13:01.792-07:002010-05-26T05:13:01.792-07:00@Simon: Let me know what you think about it!
@Ne...@Simon: Let me know what you think about it! <br /><br />@Neil: Thanks for that personalized reply Neil! It seems everyone is dragged into religion one way or another, I mean what essentially happens is that you inherit your parents religion, but there comes a time when you gotta take your own stand in life and decide: should I believe in this? What am I going to believe in? <br /><br />As you were dragged into catholicism I was dragged into Santeria (ever seen The Believers?) and than in a strange twist of events my mom and dad decide to become Jehovah's Witnesses, completely opposing religions! All I learned from both is that each religion has their own different mythology, and they all take their mythology as absolutely real, when, if you look at it all from afar, with an objective eye, you come to see that its an elaborate fairy tale, that would make a great movie (and has!) <br /><br />I need to see Nostalgia, I remember reading your review for it and being intrigued by it, I will see if I can get it for this week. Thanks for reminding me though! <br /><br />The Wicker Man was THE movie that got me thinking about all that. I was like, this movie is absolutely right! Its just ideas vs. ideas made even crazier because people (not any supernatural force) make things happen, sometimes evil things like getting 900+ people to drink poison. <br /><br />(SPOILERS AHEAD) <br /><br />In The Wicker Man, what struck me as particularly shocking was how as the christian is being burned, his god does not save him, yet the Sun, the god of the people of the island shines on, stronger than ever. To the people of the Wicker Man that was their god looking down on them, but really, it was just the sun shining. Love that movie.Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-4779938361017918702010-05-25T16:47:52.391-07:002010-05-25T16:47:52.391-07:00Franciso, congratulations on a heartfelt, passiona...Franciso, congratulations on a heartfelt, passionate and fearless post. I haven't seen 'Martyrs' yet, but it's definitely on my "must see" list now.<br /><br />When I was about 12, my mother went through a bout of what I can only describe as religious hysteria. It was a coping mechanism for her after my grandmother died. My dad retreated into running his business and had nothing to do with it, so it was me who got dragged along to interminable church services, me who sat through confirmation lessons because it was what my mother wanted, me who took communion and knew that the bread and wine was just that - bread and wine, nothing else.<br /><br />I hadn't given much thought to religion before that, but sitting there listening to the sermons, then listening to the gossip and the hypocrisy of the Mother's Union who met after the service, I was old enough to start questioning things, to think for myself. And ever since then I've never been able to reconcile myself to organised religion.<br /><br />It's strange, I've watched films with a deep religious theme, like Tarkovsky's 'Nostalgia', and been profoundly moved; but many of the people I've met who have had strong religious opinions have revealed themselves as bigots, particularly in terms of xenophobia and homophobia.<br /><br />Organised religion can be a scary thing, so it's fitting that filmmakers respond to it using the horror genre. Good call on mentioning the original 'Wicker Man' - a perfect example of fundamentalist beliefs gone wrong. What's really disturbing (SPOILERS) is that Edward Woodward's character behaves as dementedly as Christopher Lee and the islanders even as he's being burned alive. Two different belief systems, both wrong, both taken to extremes.<br /><br />Congratulations again: one of your best posts.Neil Fulwoodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14686296295535235988noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-38346180511253894222010-05-25T16:26:30.940-07:002010-05-25T16:26:30.940-07:00Excellent review, I must be seeing it.Excellent review, I must be seeing it.Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08085105568601878075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-74914534569628159692010-05-25T11:32:58.887-07:002010-05-25T11:32:58.887-07:00@POT: The fact that the cult was searching for pro...@POT: The fact that the cult was searching for proof of the afterlife is simply an allegory for religions intent of explaining what happens after death. They offer us an answer to that mystery, but its hollow, its a lie. I mean, how can anyone really know what comes after? Its that obsession with the afterlife that the film is trying to portray. Ultimately, religious people dont accept death, thats why they have to make up a fairy tale for what comes after we die.<br /><br />I thought the last frames were brilliant, everything remains a mystery, same as in real life. I guess we'll only know the answer to that when we die. Then again, maybe we will never know cause maybe we just die and thats it. <br /><br />It also shows just how far any religion is willing to go when it comes to their beliefs. Jehovah Witnesses for example dont accept blood transfusions, so they let their family members die whenever they need one. Just because their religion doesnt allow blood transfusions. Thats just one example. Many people die because of what their religion ask of them. Its sick. <br /><br />SPOILERS AHEAD!!<br /><br />@Bob: Agree with you there, I didnt know where it was going to go either. <br /><br />I wasnt aware that the the films look was modeled after Tenebrae, thanks for that bit of info. Isnt Tenebrae the one where a lot of scenes take place during the day and Argento used a lot of whites? <br />If it is, I see the similarities. <br /><br />The scene that really got me was when they captured the second girl, everything they did to her phisically represents what a religion can do to you psychologically, the feeding of the bad food representing the way they feed you their teachings, her being chained to the wall represents the restraint that religions can impose on your life, and how frustrating that can be. <br /><br />Tt one point she simply accepts the bad food that they were feeding her, I thought that represented the acceptance, the giving in to them. <br /><br />I just loved that about it, how they brought to life many of the psychologically damaging factors of religion. Even that scene where one of the cult members comes to falsely comfort her, telling her everything was going to be okay represents that false HOPE that religion sells you. <br /><br />Awesome movie, I have to purchase it right away and make it a permanent part of my collection!Franco Macabrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10994905312221715861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-44666329571190791152010-05-25T10:57:14.315-07:002010-05-25T10:57:14.315-07:00I really liked this film. You hit on the thematic...I really liked this film. You hit on the thematic issues pretty well. The other thing I liked about it is how it constantly does the unexpected. So many horror movies I see I'm always at least 2 steps ahead of the movie. If it's a well made film that doesn't ruin it for me, but it was so refreshing to have the rug pulled out from under me time and time again in 'Martyrs'. I also really liked the look of the film, which the director says was inspired by Dario Argento's 'Tenebrae'. It may share some of the extreme violence of "torture porn", but it definitely doesn't have that same cliched look that we've seen time and again in the 'Saw' series and its many imitators.Bob Igniziohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03630416222197419152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8293273378239831747.post-91863384189975145042010-05-25T10:29:43.932-07:002010-05-25T10:29:43.932-07:00I love this film and share many of your same senti...I love this film and share many of your same sentiments being a recovering Catholic myself. <br /> <br />Just the thought of a religious sect or cult hellbent on proving an afterlife while torturing the crap out of someone was enough to make me physically ill. I mean its really not out of the realm of possibility. Think about all of the televangelists, the hardcore fervoristic followers. What's left when you think you've achieved what you think is a perfect connection to God? The acts the group committed represented, in my mind, the penultimate expression and experiment to prove their faith, existence, or just plain reason for being. Again, the concept just simply floored and nauseated me.<br /><br />Excellent post amigo.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com